翻译《如何在教学中不用网志》
How NOT to use blogs in education
如何在教学中不用网志
Update: You can now find part II, how you SHOULD use blogs in education, here.
I thought I’d summarise a paper (Blogs @ Anywhere: High fidelity online communication) that I’m hoping to have accepted for ASCILITE 2005
here in two posts offering quick summaries of how I think you should
& shouldn’t try to use blogs in education. If you’re into depth
then you might prefer the paper, otherwise read on:
更新：你现在可以阅读第二部分，《你如何在教学中运用网志》。
我觉得我应该概括论文《网志无处不在：高保真的在线通讯》，这是我为ASCILITE 2005投递的两篇论文之一，快速总结了我认为你在教学中运用网志时应该或不应该做的事情。如果你深入研究，你可能会更喜欢这篇论文，否则只要知道：
Never never approach blogs as discussion boards, listservs or learning management systems:
Almost invariably the first thing people do when encountering new
technologies is to try and get it to do what the technologies they are
used to do and this is no exception when it comes to blogs.
绝不把网志当作论坛、邮件列表或者学习管理系统：当人们遭遇新技术的时候，所做的第一件事几乎是用其实现已有技术所做事情，对于网志，也不例外。
Group blogs are a bad idea and don’t work: Sure
there’s a place for collaborative/ group blogs but that place is not in
education. Blogs work well for individuals… they are tools of centred communication and pretty far removed from community management systems like Drupal. Just don’t go there!
小组网志是个坏主意，没法可行：网志是可以用作协作/团队网志，但不是用在教学中。网志用于个人才能运作良好……它们是集中交流的工作，但是离团队管理系统比如Drupal却很远。不要那样做！
Don’t try and force blogging into something else: Blogging suits highly customisable, individual, owned and fiercely flexible tools like WordPress. You can try and fit blogs into other systems such as Moodle, Drupal or Tiki
but you’re not going to do well because the entire centralised
philosophy of these systems is utterly opposed to that of successful
blogging platforms
不要尝试或强迫网志做其他事情：写日志适合高度定制的、个人的、自有的以及高度灵活的工具，比如WordPress。你可以尝试将其他系统改造成网志，比如Moodle、Druple或者Tiki，但是你不会成功，因为这些系统的基本理念就不适合成为成功的网志平台。
Ignore RSS at your peril: Probably the biggest
mistake that adopters tend to make is to ignore RSS or just through it
a casting glance. The problem is that these people aren’t bloggers and
just don’t understand. Without RSS blogs would pretty much just be
extensions of geocities pages. Your learners are NEVER going to surf
each others sites everyday and the majority of them won’t even go to
that funky web-based aggregator you set-up.
危险的忽略RSS：使用者往往忽略RSS或者认为它无关紧要，这也许是最大的错误。问题在于这些人不是博客，也不懂。没有RSS的网志最多也就是个加强版的个人网站。你的学生绝不会每天意义查看大量网站，他们大半甚至都不会去你设定的时髦的基于网页的聚合器。
Any more really bad ideas you could add?
你还能举出更糟糕的做法么？
http://blogsavvy.net/how-not-to-use-blogs-in-education/
steve cooley
said on July 28th, 2005 at 1:54 am
If
you’re setting up blogs for people, don’t be frustrated when they don’t
use them. I’ve set up a dozen blogs for other folks, and the adoption
rate is pretty low so far. The worst thing you can do is to mandate
blog authorship. Show your prospective blogging participants some good
example sites and open some discussion as to what is and what isn’t
good blogging material. If you there’s no question in your mind that
blogging is the future, and that we’ll all be bloggers some day,
they’ll get it sooner or later.
如果你为别人设置网志，而他们却不使用，请不要被困难吓倒。我为朋友设置了十多个网志，使用率低到吓人，你所能做最坏的事情就是强制网志写作。为你有前途的网志参与者展示一些好的范例网站，并就哪些是好网志哪些不是展开讨论。如果你对网志写作的未来充满信心，相信我们迟早都会成为博客，那么他们或早或晚都会成为的。
Duane Gran
said on July 28th, 2005 at 5:47 am
I’m
curious about the specific reasons against a group blog. I work with a
group of Librarians and academics in the field of Humanities Computing
on a joint venture. We are planning to set up an academic blog of sorts
where we can all post announcements and information of relevance to one
another and unforeseeable passers-by. To me it seems like an ideal
technology for our needs. You write emphatically against using blogs in
this way, but I don’t see the rationale behind the conclusion.
By chance, by academic blog do you mean something in the classroom or something used by students?
我很好奇你反对小组网志的具体原因。我和一群图书管理员以及学者一起在一家人文计算机技术领域的合资企业工作。我们打算设立一个分类的学术网志，在这里我们每个人都可以发表对彼此都能看到，而旁人看不到的公告和信息。对我而言，它似乎是我们需要的理想技术。你特别强调反对以这种方式使用网志，但是我没有看到结论背后的理由。
你所说的学术网志是指用在教室里或者学生用的？
James
said on July 28th, 2005 at 10:13 am
Thanks for the comments / links / additions people!
Duane, unless your group is particularly RSS savvy, I think that
what you need is a listserv / Yahoo groups. Announcements need to go to
people and it doesn’t sound like they’d hold much value in a broader
sense (I could of course be totally wrong there).
Blogs are centred on individuals… http://incsub.org/blogtalk/?page_id=54
I’m referring more here to blogs for teaching and learning, but I
think that your perspective is a valuable and relevant one to the
discussion.
感谢所有回复/链接/加友的朋友们！
杜安，除非你的小组对RSS有特别的理解，我想你需要的是一个邮件服务或者Yahoo小组。公告需要主动推送给人们，而且它们在广泛意义上也并没有想象中那么重要（也许我完全错了）。
网志以个人为中心……见此文。
我在这里提到很多用于教学和学习的网志，但是我想你的观点对这次讨论弥足珍贵。
Steven Mansour
said on July 28th, 2005 at 11:08 am
Great post and I agree with most of what you say. But…
好文章！我同意你大部分观点。但是……
If you’ve got a good teacher and motivator behind the project, then
group blogs are just about the best thing since sliced bread. I’ve set
up group blogs at the collegiate and university levels for a wide range
of subjects, and both students and teachers love the diversity and flow
of information that occurs when a discussion is opened on a topic. Then
there’s the added bonus of students answering each other’s questions
(monitored by the teacher for accuracy), and sub-groups working on
collaborative documents. And Drupal? Yes, it’s a CMS… but it’s also easily configured as an incredible group blogging system.
如果你有一位好的教师以及动力来支持这个项目，那么群组网志就是有史以来最好的工具了。我在学院和大学一级的很多项目中设立了群组网志。当就某个主题展开讨论的时候，学生老师都很喜欢这种多样性及其信息流。然后对于学生回答其他人提出的问题还有额外奖励（由老师监查其正确性），并对共同的文档进行分组工作。Drupal？是的，那是一个CMS……但是也很容易配置成一套优秀的群组网志系统！
I’ll agree on this for Moodle and Tiki, but for Drupal, again… this
couldn’t be farther from the truth. The granular access permissions and
total configurability - while confusing for the novice - permits a
thoroughly decentralised, democratic setup - or a centralised
dictatorship. Drupal has been and will continue to be used as a
successful group blogging platform.
就Moodle和Tiki，我同意，但是对于Drupal，再一次……不要错得太离谱哦。个人访问权限和总体配置——虽然对于新手有些困难——允许彻底分散的、民主的配置，或者中央集权式的。Drupal 一直也并将继续被用作一个成功的群组网志平台。
James
said on July 28th, 2005 at 11:46 am
Hmmmm…
yes you can get people communicating using group blogs, they will
probably even enjoy it, but you’d be better off using Drupal as a
community management system wouldn’t you?
嗯，是的，你可以用群组网志让人们交流，他们或许还会喜欢上它，但是你最好用Drupal作为社区管理系统，对不对？
For me, to steal a phrase from Greg Ritter, group blogging is like
hammering nails with a saw… novelty value high, but practically, you’re
probably better off with community tools.
对于我，借用一句李贵的话，群组网志就像使用锯子钉钉子……非常新颖，但实际上，最好使用一个专门的交流工具。
As for Drupal… come on, allowing people to select from pre-installed
themes is hardly decentralised, when they are totally individually
editable, configurable (plugins etc.), exportable / importable and as
good a systems as half of the blogging tools out there then I’ll come
to the party.
至于Drupal……算了吧，让人们从预安装主题当中做出选择是一种极不负责的表现，当系统是完全可以单独编辑、配置（插件等），有导入/导出功能，并且如果系统有网志工具的一般好的话，那么我就加入。
A Drupal install for each user = very good… everyone in one Drupal environment = not so hot.
为每个用户安装一套Drupal，很好……所有用户都在一个Drupal环境中，就没那么好。
More on that here: http://incsub.org/blog/2005/multi-user-weblogging
Are there any really good examples of learners using blogs in Drupal
environments over the course of more than one semester… or for that
fact anyone really developing a successful / extended over time blog as
part of a Drupal environment?
I haven’t seen it work myself.
更多相关资料请参考……
有无真正的好例子，关于学习者在Drupal环境下使用网志完成一个学期以上的课程的……或者在真实环境中某人真的在Drupal环境下开发过一款成功的/长时间使用的网志？
我自己没见到过。
Martin Pluss
said on July 28th, 2005 at 1:27 pm
Hi all,
I was interested in the comment about the group blogging.
In Cool Running blogs the individual ones fair the best.
I have developed one for Geography teachers
http://www.incsub.org/wpmu/gtansw/
and find it hard to generate any interest to get comments let alone
postings. In fact it has I suspect started a bit of competition with
those who use a related Yahoo Group and do not see the value (yet) of
jumping across to blogging.
Cheers Plu
大家好，
我对有关群组网志的回复很感兴趣。
网志对个人而言运作得非常好。
我为地理教师开发了一款……
发现它很难激起回复的兴趣，更不用说发帖了。事实上我怀疑，开始在和新加入写网志的人当中，以前那些使用Yahoo群组的、没有看到其价值所在的人，做对抗。
顺祝安康，兄弟们！
Paul Ebert
said on July 28th, 2005 at 2:12 pm
I
use a group blog with a postgraduate course that I teach. Aspects of
the course are fairly self-directed. I find the blog to be a brilliant
way to encourage the students to share with each other what they are
learning in their individual projects. It makes the course more
interesting for them and for me as well. The blog has a central theme
and the students are requirted to make one post, but that is enough to
get the more enthusiastic students posting on their own. It is exciting
to see enthusiasm building on enthusiasm.
This may not fit your idea of what a blog should be, but I have found it to be a very good use of a group blog.
我在使用群组网志记录我所教的一门研究生课程。课程方面在很大程度上是自我引导的。我发现网志是一条鼓励学生彼此分享各自在各自项目中的所学的金光大道。无论是对他们还是对我，都让课程更有趣。网志有一个中心议题，要求学生至少发一贴，但也有足够的空间让热心的学生在其自己的网志上发表更多。看到热火朝天的工作，我很开心。
这也许跟你对什么是网志的看法不一样，但是我发现群组网志非常好用。
Steven Mansour
said on July 28th, 2005 at 2:57 pm
Themes? I don’t understand… what does any of this have to do with
themes? We’re talking e-learning, group collaboration and virtual
classroom - all of which have corresponding setups in Drupal, which is
also replete with plugin (’modules’ they call ‘em). Import / Export? No
problem. As a stand-alone, single-user blogging system, I’ll agree with
you that it’s not that great… but as an academic group blog or
collaborative community system, I’ve seen it work wonders.
So whether or not you’ll ‘come to the party’, the party’s already begun.
主题？我不明白……这跟主题有什么关系？我们在谈论电子化学习，小组合作和虚拟教师，这些在Drupal中都有相应的设置，也都充满了插件（他们称之为模块）。导入导出？没问题。作为独立的、单用户的网志系统，我赞同你所说的他不是够好……但是作为一个学术群组网志，或者合作交流系统，我看它就工作得很好嘛！
The contrary is true. The whole point of multi-user is to get everyone involved together.
Whether this is Drupal, Moodle, Clay Tablets, etc. That’s the advantage
that community / group blogging has over a simple, single-user,
‘lecture’ blog (although those have their place too).
事实是恰恰相反。多用户的重点在于大家参与。无论是Drupal、Moodle，还是泥板什么的。这是社区/群组网志对于简单的单用户的讲义式网志（虽然他们也有自己的用处）的优点。
Yes, you’ll find some here. The work I’ve done for McGill, while not public, will also be published soon.
你在这里就能找到。我为麦克吉尔所做的工作，虽然还没有公开，但很快了。
I have.
Just because you’ve never seen it doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist…
Cheers,
Steve
我见过。
不能仅仅因为你没见到过，就说它就没有……
祝安
James
said on July 28th, 2005 at 3:44 pm
“e-learning, group collaboration and virtual classroom” are three of my least favourite words.
“电子化学习，小组合作以及虚拟教室”是我最不喜欢的三个单词。
I think we’re coming at this from different worlds… I’m of the world
that says in order to be part of a community you need to be able to
establish and project an identity… personal presence if you will.
Drupal allows you to, to a degree, develop an identity in a particular
space, if you will it’s a bit like being part of a church and your
identity being so bound up in that environment that you don’t have much
of one outside of it.
我想我们是从另一个世界来到这里的……属于这个世界，是说为了能够参与到社区，你需要能够建立和规划一个身份……必躬必亲，如果你想的话。Drupal可以让你在一定程度上，在一个特定空间建立一个身份，但是如果你指望他成为教堂的一部分，你的身份完全融入这个环境，那么你得不到像外面世界那么多东西的。
Yes, of course you can have a discussion there, you can get people
collaborating and it can be a great hub for all sorts of activities
(especially OSS ones, groups with particular focus etc.) but I strongly
believe that in order for us to effectively participate in multiple
communities, communication and identity needs to be centred on the
individual and not the group.
是的，你当然可以在那儿展开讨论，你可以与人合作，它也可以成为绝佳的活动中心（尤其是开源软件活动等针对特定目标的活动），但是我仍然相信，为了让我们有效参与到多个社区，通讯和身份应当集中在个人而非小组身上。
I’m not saying that Drupal has no use, it has lots and I’ve used it
in a number of different contexts pretty and very successfully.
我并不是说Drupal没有用，它很有用，我也在很多不同的场合中愉快的使用它，也很成功。
What I am saying is that blogs are more than just spaces for
writing, they are the development of digital identities (and I think
you got the wrong end of what I was saying about Drupal… I *do* think
it’s a very powerful tool for an individual) of digital representations
of ourselves from which we are able to engage ion other communities…
quite possibly / definitely incorporating elements of tools like
Drupal… but most certainly not stemming out of it.
我所说的是，网志不仅仅是写作的空间，它也是发展我们自己的数码身份（我想，在最后我谈及Drupal的时候，你误会了……我的确认为它是一个非常强大的个人工具），在这里我们能够一个人的身份参与到其他社团……很有可能，甚至一定，像Drupal一样混合工具的组件……但是基本上不会动其根本。
I have spent an awful lot of time exploring, examining, researching
and looking into online education (I’m a lecturer in education design
in my other life) and while you can do some ‘OK’ work using Drupal /
other CMSs over a semester - certainly better than BB or WebCT - and
you can use it even more effectively for non-time limited interest
groups and projects, I just don’t reckon that, as a multi-user blogging
platform it will work out.
我花了很多时间探索、考察、研究、调查线上教育（我的另一个身份是教学设计讲师），虽然你可以利用Drupal或者其他内容管理系统良好运作超过一个学期——肯定要好过BB或者WebCT——你也可以将其用于无时间限制的兴趣小组及项目，使之更有效果，我不考虑这个是因为它能胜任多用户网志平台。
Sure I could be wrong, I frequently am, and it’s just an opinion but do I think I’m onto something here.
To quote Robert Paterson: “How can we have a relationship with
another when we have lost the core relationship with our own selves?”
(oh, and themes do matter… believe me!)
我肯定有错误，我常犯错误，并且那仅仅是我的个人观点，但是我想我还是有所发现的。
引用裴若倍的话：“当我们失去与我们自己的核心关系时，我们怎么能和别人建立关系呢？”
（噢，关于主题的问题……请相信我！）
Steven Mansour
said on July 29th, 2005 at 2:15 am
They’re three of my favorite.
这是我最喜欢的三个单词。
I also think we’re coming at this from different angles. As
important as identity and the concept of the ‘personal space’ are,
education is - and will continue to be - a collaborative, group effort.
Since one-to-one relationships between educators and each student in
the classroom, the living conversation that we’ve been creating using
different systems (including Drupal, among others) in classrooms and
academic departments have permitted us to take knowledge building from
the ‘bird-feeding-birdie’ approach to something more akin to a hive of
bees.
Specifically, how can you create identities in other systems that you can’t do in Drupal?
我也认为我们是从不同的角度出发。身份和所谓的个人空间同样重要，教育是——并将一直是——集体合作努力的结果。从教育者和教室内的每一个学生之间的一对一关系开始，我们在教室和学术部门里使用不同系统（包括Drupal以及其他）所创造的实际对话，使得我们构建知识的方法从小鸟喂食式发展到某种蜂群形式。
具体说说，你是如何在其他系统中创建在Drupal中不愿创建的身份的？
Don’t get me wrong - Drupal is not a panacea for anything. I use a
) is that I
suite of tools for different uses, and in many cases Drupal is either
overkill or inappropriate. The reason I keep coming back to it (and
writing these boring, lengthy comments
have precisely seen these digital representations evolve and
collaborate in an educational / academic setting evolve from systems
I’ve created based on Drupal. - and Wordpress, and Moodle, and MovableType, and Mambo, and…
不要误解我的意思——Drupal不是灵丹妙药。我对不同用途使用不同工具，在许多情况下Drupal可能会过火或者不合适。我之所以回过头来继续用它（并写下这些无聊的冗长的评论），是因为我非常清楚地看到，在我基于Drupal创造的系统当中，这些数字化表达方式在教育及学术机构中的发展与协作。当然还有Wordpress，Moodle以及MovableType，和Mambo等……
I think we do very similar work, albeit with very different approaches. Any CMS, blogging system, etc. can be configured / hacked / maimed to be anything you want it to be.
The issue I had with your original post is this: contrary to what
you’ve stated in your post, of the many tools I use (pretty much all
open-source), I’ve found that Drupal can a) be used as group blog which is not a bad idea and which does work,and b) Drupal
has as many blog-specific features as any ‘blogging-only’ package, and
its philosophy is anything but centralised - it’s easily geared to be a
top-notch blogging platform - group or not.
我想我们从事着非常类似的工作，虽然用的是非常不同的方法。任何内容管理系统、网志系统等，都可以被配置、修改、剪裁成任何你想要的样子。对于你的帖子，我的态度是：反对你在帖子中声明的。我用过很多工具（差不多都是开源产品），我发现Drupal能够【甲】用作群组网志不是一个坏主意，它能够运作下去，并且【乙】Drupal 具有许多其他专门网志软件包具有的网志特有功能，它的核心理念不管是什么也不是中央控制——它很容易被调整成拔尖的网址平台——无论群组与否。
I don’t think it’s a question of right or wrong, or good or bad.
Your experience with Drupal and with education in general has led you
to these conclusions, and I’m not trying to dispute the way you do
things. I’m just trying to point out that two of your blanket
statements in your post are factually inaccurate, because I’ve seen
them disproven, group blogs can work, and Drupal is nowhere near as centralised as you might have found.
我不觉得这是一个对错或者好坏的问题。一般来说，是你在教育中使用Drupal的经验，让你得出这些结论，我并不想争论你的行事之道。我仅仅想指出你文中两个结论事实上是不正确的，因为我见证过它们的错误，群组网志可以工作，Drupal 远远谈不上你所发现的集中控制。
Other than that, I agree with your point about RSS.
Cheers,
Steve
除此之外，我赞成你关于RSS的观点。
祝安
Steven Mansour
said on July 29th, 2005 at 2:27 am
*typo:
所写：
should read:
“Since one-to-one relationships between educators and each student in the classroom are impossible”.
应该理解为：
“从教育者和教室内的每一个学生之间的一对一关系成为不可能开始”
Chris Curtis
said on July 29th, 2005 at 7:07 am
Interesting
comments, but they seem to depend on a rather specific and exclusive
definition of “blog”. I prefer to stick to the idea that a “blog” (i.e.
weblog) is a collection of individual articles or “posts” organised
primarily by time. You can do this with many different tools, you can
do this in groups or as individuals, and you can do it for almost any
purpose you want. If it is wrong to define new technologies in terms of
what went before, it is also wrong to define a new technology too
tightly too quickly - it becomes what people choose to use it for, not
what someone thinks it should be.
Like any activity, blogging is educational when it helps people learn.
I think there are many more kinds of blogging that help people learn
than you would suggest.
有趣的评论，但是大家似乎都依赖于一个相当具体且排他的“网志”定义。我宁愿坚持这样一个观点，“网志”（网络日志）是一组按时间排序的个人文章或者帖子。你可以利用很多工具做到这一点，你可以通过群组或者个人做到这一点，你也可以为任何目的做到这一点。如果赶在新技术前面给出定义是错误的，那么给新技术下定义太严太快也是错误的——它将根据人们的用途而非某人的想法而变化。
如同任何活动，当写网志有助于人们学习的时候是一种教育活动。我想，有比你建议的更多类型的网志，都能帮助人们学习。
James
said on July 29th, 2005 at 10:03 am
Heh,
it’s interesting that my considered, balanced and referenced posting of
the paper didn’t get much discussion at all… whereas blanket statements
get me the best conversations.
Bugger, am I becoming a a shock-blog
嘿，我觉得很有趣，实际上，对论文的引用和对比并没有引起很多讨论……然而总结的结论让我得到最好的交谈。
小子，我将成为一名争议博客。
James
said on July 29th, 2005 at 10:10 am
Thanks Chris… [places shock hat on]… successful blogs are individual blogs… successful group blogs are more like zines.
谢谢克里斯……【作吃惊状】……成功的网志是个人网志……成功的群组网志更像爱好者自办杂志。
Bernie Goldbach
said on July 29th, 2005 at 8:33 pm
I
think your broadside at group blogs having little value in education
needs to be substantiated because I have found meritorious use with
directed activities that culminate in contributions to a group weblog.
我想，你对群组网志的批判，在需要求证的教育工作中没有什么价值，因为我在导向活动中找到有价值的用途，向群组网志发表文章，取得极大的成功。
James
said on July 30th, 2005 at 1:10 am
Hi Bernie, have a look here for some substantiation / theory: http://incsub.org/blog/2005/blogs-anywhere-high-fidelity-online-communication
Especially Krause (2004):
“or Krause (2004) the experience of using blogs in a graduate
seminar called “Rhetoric and Culture of Cyberspace” made him wonder if:
“it is advisable or even possible to see blogs as a collaborative
or especially “interactive” writing environments… I’ve come to believe
we shouldn’t substitute blogs for other electronic writing tools that
foster discussion and interactive writing, particularly email lists,
commonly known as ‘listservs” (Krause 2004)”
嗨，贝尼，关于某些实证或理论，可以看看这篇文章。
特别是克劳斯（2004）：
“或者，克劳斯（2004）在一个叫做‘网络空间的修辞学与文化’的研究生研讨班上使用网志的经验，让他想知道是否：
“这是明智的，甚至可能看到网志作为写作或者特别“互动”写作环境……我逐渐相信我们不应该用网志代替其他培养讨论和交互式写作的网络协作工具，尤其是邮件列表，一般称之为“列表服务”（克劳斯2004）”
Chris Lott
said on July 30th, 2005 at 3:50 am
I
should add that there are many definitions of group blog. If you’re
talking about the very narrow space of “collaborative writing” as
traditionally perceived, then I agree that it’s a misfit.
我需要补充一点，群组网志有很多定义。如果你谈论传统认识中的狭义“协作写作”，那么我同意，不合适。
You also seem to be conflating two points, or at least assuming that
“group blog” has similarities to “discussion board” when that seems far
from the case if you are using them effectively (plus you already made
that point in the first rule
你似乎混淆了两种观点，或者至少在你不能有效使用它们的时候假设“群组网志”类似于“论坛”（再加上你将这种观点放在第一的位置上）。
Lois Horn
said on August 16th, 2005 at 12:44 am
Ok….just
when I thought I was on a roll with group blogs, I’m feeling like I’m
headed in the wrong direction. I was going to use blogs in Canadian
History as a way to collaborate….any suggestions???
好吧……只是当我想到我也是使用群组网志的一分子的时候，我觉得我做错了。我曾打算在加拿大历史课程中使用网志，以此来协作……有什么建议么？
Jonathan Maybaum
said on October 14th, 2005 at 11:39 am
Your
comment: “Don’t try and force blogging into something else” resonates
fiercely with me. It drives me crazy when I hear someone ask “How can I
do X with a blog?” (or a wiki, for that matter). The concept that ideas
should drive your tools, rather than having your tools dictate you
ideas, is the primary reason behind development that we have done at
the Univiersity of Michigan, to provide an environment in which
ordinary people (i.e., non-programmers) can make their own interactive
web applications, designed around their unique scholarly objectives.
你的总结“不要尝试或者强迫网志做其他什么事情”引起我强烈共鸣。每当我听到有人问我“我能在网志（说到这个，还有维基）上做某某事情么？”这几乎让我发疯。物为人用，而非人为物役，这是我们在密歇根大学所作开发的主要理由，我们为普通人（非程序员）提供一个环境，让他们制作自己的交互式网页程序，设计实现其独有的学术目标。
I wrote about this system (called UM.SiteMaker) in a short article
that was published at the Apple Digital Campus Exchange. Here is a link
to a copy that you can get without needing to sign up for a login there:
我在发表在《苹果数码校园交流》的一篇短文中谈及这个系统（称为UM.SiteMaker）。这里有一份链接，你可以直接获取而无需登录：
http://sitemaker.umich.edu/sitemaker.resources/files/when-blogging-is-not-enough.pdf
Grant
said on October 21st, 2005 at 3:22 pm
Now see what you done James!
I have my students saying that group blogs arent good for education…..
I’ve been using a group blog for my students this semester and I think its been a good experience, so far…
I’ll publish my findings on my own blog down the track
詹姆斯你现在看看你干了什么！现在我有学生说群组网志在教学中用的不是很好……
这个学期曾让学生使用群组网志，迄今为止我认为这是个好体验……
我将我的发现发表于我的网志，下面有引用。
Scott Lankford
said on December 11th, 2005 at 6:59 am
Like
many others, I’m confused and a bit dismayed by your blanket dismissal
of group blogs — and I strongly suggest you rethink it (or at least do
some honest research) before presenting your paper. Witness the many,
many previous posts questioning your judgment on precisely this point.
But since I’m a big fan of your advice in general, and always open to
finding something better, I did do a very carefully read-through of the
DRUPAL user’s manual, just as you suggested. Obviously it’s a wonderful
opensource tool! However, I also have to say it’s still far, far too
complex for me to consider setting one up for my students (or even for
myself for that matter). Remember, this is a proud low-tech type
English professor speaking here: someone who believes that the very
best thing about blogs — and the whole secret to their explosive
growth– is that almost anyone can learn to build a basic one in under
five mintues. The proof is in the cyber-pudding: millions and millions
of new bloggers already. Including many of my own students, most of
whom have set up their own blogs long before I ever assigned one as
part of my course. And that’s where your blanket prohibition against
group blogs just falls flat — at least for me. I just think experts
(like yourself) get so accustomed to your hyper-high-tech cyberspeak
that you lose focus on the needs of ordinary dumb-dumb lowend users,
such as myself. But if you’re gonna call yourself a consultant, you
should (re)consider our needs before issuing blanket prohibitions from
On High!
跟其他人一样，对于你对群组网志的概括性拒绝，我有些困惑，还有一点失望——我强烈建议你再发表论文之前重新考虑（或者至少做一些真正的研究）。看到前面这么多帖子都在质疑你在这一点上的判断力。但是由于我基本上算是你的崇拜者，并且始终不停追求美好事物，我曾经按你建议的那样，非常仔细的通读过Drupal用户手册。很显然这是一款非常优秀的开源工具！然而，我也要说，对我而言，它也太太太复杂了，我曾考虑为我的学生设置一份（甚至就是为我自己）。记住，这是一个骄傲的、不懂技术的英语系教授的发言：有人相信，对于网志最好的事情——网志爆发式增长的秘密所在——莫过于几乎每个人都能学会在五分钟内建立起一套基本的网志。证据就在电子布丁里：数以百万计的新博客已经诞生。包括我很多学生，大多数都在我还未曾为课程指定网志的时候，就已经建立了他们自己的网志。这也是你反对群组网志的概括性陈述完全失败的地方——至少对我是的。我只是想，专家（比如你）是如此习惯于你们的高超技术发言，而丢失了对平常沉默一组低端用户——比如我——的需要的关注。但是如果你打算把自己当作一名顾问，你应该在高高在上的发表你的概括性陈述之前重新考虑我们的需求！
As for examples of successful group blogs in education, check out
Lewis Elementary School’s “Classroom Notes” as a useful example. it’s
low-tech, user-friendly, and working just fine, thank you. http://lewiselementary.org/notes/
至于应用在教育中的群组网志的成功例子，可以看刘易斯小学的“课堂笔记”。这是一个低技术的、用户友好的、并且工作良好的有用例子。谢谢。
James
said on December 12th, 2005 at 12:21 pm
If you read the paper it’s not blanket, just hammering nails with a saw.
Too late re: presentation though
I don’t understand what you’re getting at to be honest, yes blogs have
grown in use but that doesn’t prove whether group blogs work or not and
the site you referenced is cute but a. isn’t for educational purposes
(it’s for communicating with parents) & b. isn’t much of a blog
(it’s really a website published by multiple users using a blogging
tool).
Tim’s a great thinker & writer and may or may not agree with
what I’m saying here, but I doubt he’d claim that that site refutes my
claims.
Didn’t realise I was on-high either… but I guess it’s just a matter of perspective.
如果你看了这份论文，就知道它并不是概括性的，只是用锯子钉钉子。
回复得太迟了，已经发表了
我不明白你挖苦的骄傲是指什么，是的，网志在增长，但这并不证明群组网志是否工作，并且，你引用的网站是很好，但是【甲】它不是用于教学目的（它是用于和家长之间的交流）；【乙】它也没有多少网志的影子（它实际上是多名用户利用网志工具发布的网站）。
丁是一个位好的思想家及作家，并且可能或者可能不同意我在这里所说的，但是我怀疑他会宣称该网站驳斥了我的申明。
我没有意识到我是高高在上的……但是我猜这仅仅是一个视角的问题。
Peter J. Vitale
said on March 19th, 2006 at 2:46 am
I
am currently in a graduate adolescent education class centered around
incorporating technology into instruction. We are researching different
ways of communicating using the internet. I don’t ever use blogs but I
found the views expressed by educators to be hypocritical. Either they
are beneficial for education or they are not. No gray area here. I am
not yet an educator but I feel that anything that can appeal to
students, especially at the high school level, in terms of a
communication bridge is a positive tool.
我现在在一个青春期教育研究生班，研究将技术融入教学。我们研究互联网上不同的交流方式。我不曾使用网志，但是我发现教育工作者所表达的观点都是虚伪的，不管他们的观点对教育有益与否。这里黑白分明。我还不是一个教师，但是我觉得能吸引学生的任何东西，尤其在高校层次，就交流手段而言，是一种积极工具。